Cobaltchat.com

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John had a commemt regarding superchargers and thought I would post a new thread as the discussion would be interesting.




"Aslan, I've wondered if an Eaton TVS supercharger would be a good fit for a boat like a Cobalt that runs on a gas engine. I suspect in another 5-10 years we'll start to see more of them as manufacturers try to bring weight down and boost efficiency, much like what's going on in cars now.

I still can't believe sometimes we tow our boat with a 180 cu. in. (3L) engine in our Tourareg...

John"




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Great question John.

I know Whipple makes the SC kit as an aftermarket add on for Merc engines such as the 496 HO. It costs about $7-8000 and includes the intercooler, SC, pulleys , belt and remapping software. What it does not include are the beefed up outdrive or engine components (most likely needed) as well as the higher pitched props required due to the HP increase. I'm sure Eaton does something similar.

Merc introduced a turbo charged engine a number of years ago on their racing applications which debuted at the Miami boat show (2013 maybe?). They apparently solved the dreaded turbo lag issue that plagues turbo charged engines. In fact, the turbo curve was flat throughout the entire RPM. range! ...thus it does not need a high RPM to "compress". It's quite sophisticated and VERY costly. Supercharger's could go the way of the dinosaur if developed to the point where it's not cost prohibitive.

With that being said, I would expect that technology to roll down to the consumer boat market for reasons you mentioned. Even the 600Sci & 700Sci supercharged racing engine technology I would think would flow down to consumer boat's. IMHO, it really comes down to hull & engine/outdrive component strength coupled with a price consumers are willing to pay for the extra ooomph.

Of course with increased compression and power comes increased heat. Fortunately we have an unlimited source of water when we run our boats. I just need mine to flow thru the engine without that dreaded alarm going off!

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I threw out Eaton because I think their supercharger is the best one on the market (the TVS line, anyway). I know a bunch of OEMs use their superchargers in factory installations (Toyota, Mercedes, Lotus, GM, etc.), and Magnuson sells a bunch of kits using their superchargers for various applications (most require a revised intake manifold) - see:

http://www.magnacharger.com/

A bit of online reading suggests that stock cams and pistons in most marine engines may already be stressed enough without adding boost, so it may be a bigger project than just bolting one on and reprogramming.

John

You both give a great perspective on power vs breakage and reliabity..

Why a boat with 425hp and a weight of 4500lb
Can only achieve 60 mph is just the design of drag vs proplulsion.

My automotive thinking doesn't apply to the boat world in engine power for the reason of Reversion in the exhaust.
As you all know the water cooled exhaust that allows fresh water to be inches away from a combustion chamber is risky bizz.

You are limited in cam overlap and cam centerline so as not to pulse water back in at idle..
There is the reason that a merc marine normally asperated 565 series blue motor will make less power that a street version with different cam profile.
Hence the " dry exhust" race motors that don't worry about it.

I am a supercharger fan as I have done my share of street and race set ups with intake heat is the most restricted factor.
I believe marine supercharged engines will become more common as the companies get the outdrives to handle the torque ( not just hp)
And cubic inches decrease as the efficiency of the engines won't require 8.2 ltr vs the now 6.2 ltr.

Imagine a emmision compliant 6.2 ltr with a factory supercharger and factory ecm programming making 565 hp?? That's is fuel efficient at cruise speed.

I'm ready!!! Just need a outdrive.. that will be next

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"I am a supercharger fan"


"I threw out Eaton because I think their supercharger is the best one on the market (the TVS line, anyway)."


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You and me both, Matt.

...and John, I totally agree with your thoughts on the Eaton TVS line. I have a TVS 2300 (2.3 liter) supercharger on our 2014 Shelby. What a beast for a production car. 15 pounds of boost.
Would love to see this on a production Merc.

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AsLan7 wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:32 pm
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"I am a supercharger fan"


"I threw out Eaton because I think their supercharger is the best one on the market (the TVS line, anyway)."


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You and me both, Matt.

...and John, I totally agree with your thoughts on the Eaton TVS line. I have a TVS 2300 (2.3 liter) supercharger on our 2014 Shelby. What a beast for a production car. 15 pounds of boost.
Would love to see this on a production Merc.

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Wow.....................!!! Nice ride! May have to get a full side shot of that beauty!!

.. Just a little ol 11. second street car. make my Chevy brothers nervous

cmattj wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:40 pm

AsLan7 wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:32 pm
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"I am a supercharger fan"


"I threw out Eaton because I think their supercharger is the best one on the market (the TVS line, anyway)."


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You and me both, Matt.

...and John, I totally agree with your thoughts on the Eaton TVS line. I have a TVS 2300 (2.3 liter) supercharger on our 2014 Shelby. What a beast for a production car. 15 pounds of boost.
Would love to see this on a production Merc.

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Wow.....................!!! Nice ride! May have to get a full side shot of that beauty!!

.. Just a little ol 11. second street car. make my Chevy brothers nervous

Nice!

I love ALL cars. They each have their niche & place in the history books. Shelby just happened to be a 2014 20 year (actually 22 years) military gift to myself. Ordered it fully loaded...went to Guam to fight Kim jung Un....cane back two months later and picked it up.

Carroll Shelby is my hero. Taking a production mustang and giving it 662 hp from the factory with a 202 mph top speed still blows my mind. Then Carroll went up and died on me. Wish I could afford an original Cobra but I am not Pack St. Clair. Thus the blue and white paint scheme in honor of him and those original AC 427 monsters.

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I'm not much of a car guy or a big hp guy but I think I could get to liking it.lol
Sweet ride.

Sweet mustang. Hmm, if I ever make it out your way would you be willing to rent it out. I promise to get it under 200.

Big Block Power wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 8:17 pm I'm not much of a car guy or a big hp guy but I think I could get to liking it.lol
Sweet ride.

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That's funny bfun220. I think we could work something out.


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....and Thx BigBlockPower.

It's not a big block but I think she is worthy of your standards.

My boys and I installed a Ford Racing throttle, remapped the tune and had her dyno'd at a local race shop.

She put down over 700 HP at the rear wheels which is just over 800 HP at the crank.

I told my wife to remember two thing when she drives it:

" Watch the splitter on the front end when pulling up to curbs since it's so low you could scrape it".

And

"Never floor it".


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Never had a Ford. But man I could see that in my garage.

Bfun220 wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:07 pm Never had a Ford. But man I could see that in my garage.

That's ironic, bfun. It's my first Ford as well.

Yep, I was a camaro guy in my younger days. But if I was looking for that type of car now I would differently go for the mustang with the same paint as yours.

AsLan7 wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 8:59 pm

I told my wife to remember two thing when she drives it:

" Watch the splitter on the front end when pulling up to curbs since it's so low you could scrape it".

And

"Never floor it".





Uhhh yeah.. I'm sure she wrote that down and pinned it to the sun visor next to the " Cold tire " label!!

Haha!! What we don't know


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[/quote]

I considered the Whipple kit, but it is not compliant with my '13 350 Mag MPI. I understand the B3 drive can handle up to 400+ hp, and one can adjust the pulley size to dial in HP to some point. I would love to have 450 HP on tap just for fun, but alas I'll have to wait until I can order a R30 with dual 420's. I run 51.7 MPH now, and it would be fun to squeeze out 60 to 65 MPH.
Chris

Ran across this article in the October Car & Driver while waiting to get my hairs cut.

Engineers are attempting to reduce turbo lag and make turbos more efficient by placing multiple smaller turbos as close as possible to the exhaust ports and two individual throttles per cylinder allowing the cylinders to fill more quickly rapidly generating full torque.

Called synergistic induction and turbocharging.