Let's see your Tow rigs with your boat!

[Big Block Power]

Now you have our attention. I would love to supercharge the burb but just can't seem to come up with the change to do it.

[Tuscany]

Here's a real low blow teaser BB.
If you are going to play with HP, do yourself a huge service. Save the change and buy a diesel next go. Any of them. Cummins, Duramaxipad or Power Stroke. For you, crew cab for the Fam. Lots of them out there now, and with your connections......

My last Super Duty dynoed 1186 lbs of torque on a KEM 345 delete tuner and exhaust. Cost about $2,500. EGR gone. An instant 300 hp, couple that with 24 MPG highway. Towing was a joke. I never ran the quarter with it, but identical set ups ran in the high 11's/low 12's with 3:73s. . Seriously plug and play..
Gasoline can not support real power upgrades unless you rebuild everything, and even then, it won't come close to stock diesel numbers. Even if you can make a few lbs of gasoline torque, it will be at an RPM level that you never use.

I made the mistake of going back to gas on this GMC. I got caught up on 1,500 under invoice and a huge rebate. Towing is a joke in the other direction. I'm going back to diesel..

[smokymance]

Here's a real low blow teaser BB.
If you are going to play with HP, do yourself a huge service. Save the change and buy a diesel next go. Any of them. Cummins, Duramaxipad or Power Stroke. For you, crew cab for the Fam. Lots of them out there now, and with your connections......

My last Super Duty dynoed 1186 lbs of torque on a KEM 345 delete tuner and exhaust. Cost about $2,500. EGR gone. An instant 300 hp, couple that with 24 MPG highway. Towing was a joke. I never ran the quarter with it, but identical set ups ran in the high 11's/low 12's with 3:73s. . Seriously plug and play..
Gasoline can not support real power upgrades unless you rebuild everything, and even then, it won't come close to stock diesel numbers. Even if you can make a few lbs of gasoline torque, it will be at an RPM level that you never use.

I made the mistake of going back to gas on this GMC. I got caught up on 1,500 under invoice and a huge rebate. Towing is a joke in the other direction. I'm going back to diesel..

Completely agree!

Next toy will be a diesel...i built this truck w no towing in mind...next is for sure a diesel! the power gains are insane plus they sound so cool!

[Tuscany]

I would love a V-8 CGI diesel in my boat so I don’t have to hear that annoying gas engine wound out anymore. Imagine cruising at 40 mph at 2000 RPM..
Some day...

I think you will see smaller diesel creep into, and replace gasoline engines in future mid sized and large SUVs. Now that we are past total EGR cylinder treatment, and on to reliable SCR emission technology, it will be hard to deny the power to fuel mileage ratio.
The heavy pickups will all be touting 1000 lbs of stock torque by the 2020 model year, and with decent fuel mileage.

[Big Block Power]

I think I heard the other day Volvo auto or Mercedes ws going away from diesel 100% gone.
I would love a dirty max. Or a ram evo diesel with some extra ho and torque.

[thunder550]

Personally I think the smaller gas turbo engines are the future, at least until they find a way to make a good electric truck. Diesels are so much more expensive, especially once you add on the emissions crap. They have their place, but I can't see them being the standard in a base model truck, it would drive the cost up too much. With forced induction, direct injection, variable valve timing, cylinder shutoff, etc, the gassers are beginning to close the efficiency gap with diesels. Diesels make loads more torque obviously, but not everyone needs or is willing to pay for it.

Did you guys see that in 2019 the base Silverado engine is going to be a turbo 4?

[Big Block Power]

Personally I think the smaller gas turbo engines are the future, at least until they find a way to make a good electric truck. Diesels are so much more expensive, especially once you add on the emissions crap. They have their place, but I can't see them being the standard in a base model truck, it would drive the cost up too much. With forced induction, direct injection, variable valve timing, cylinder shutoff, etc, the gassers are beginning to close the efficiency gap with diesels. Diesels make loads more torque obviously, but not everyone needs or is willing to pay for it.

Did you guys see that in 2019 the base Silverado engine is going to be a turbo 4?

I agree with you. Yes I saw that the other day. It's putting out as much hp as the v6. Also has cyl cut out. Going to be running on 2 cyl. Lol

[NautiGirl]

I think I heard the other day Volvo auto or Mercedes ws going away from diesel 100% gone.
I would love a dirty max. Or a ram evo diesel with some extra ho and torque.

You don't want an EcoDiesel or the Ford F150 3.0 Diesel, neither are designed for real towing or "truck stuff". They make ok torque down low, but they don't make enough HP to get out of their own way on the highway.

The other problem is available payload. Diesel engines are heavy compared to gas. Even the small "PowerStroke" eats up a TON of the GVWR in a 1/2 Ton Truck. Hell, I have heard of Diesel F250's that have less available payload than a gas F150 just due to the fact that the PowerStroke in the front is so heavy. Lot of people go Single Rear Wheel F350 for this very reason.

I haven't shopped the Dodge as we are a Ford Family, but the F150 diesel is a $9,500 option that Ford tried to shoehorn into their already crowded engine lineup. If you are going to buy a diesel buy a 3/4 Ton or 1 Ton truck to go w/ it, just my humble opinion.

[Tuscany]

The cost is excessive, no doubt. But, a good share of the extra cost is reimbursed at trade in time. The towing difference is night and day, at more than twice the torque of the gas option. As Nauti or Jeff pointed out, weight is an issue. Ford has addressed the 6.7l by using a CGI block. Definitely worth it to me.
The vast majority of Super Duty trucks are ordered with the diesel option. I'm not sure of the number, but I believe it's around 70%. I think you have to own one to fully appreciate the upgrade. I've had three, and going back for the fourth.

As far as Mercedes, expensive emissions equipment has played a role, but that NOx standard has basically been trashed by Scott Pruitt. I do not know the fine print, but I do know Glider kits with pre-emission engines are still an option for the next few years. It will be interesting to see how the Diesel landscape changes.
Look for easing emission standards to unleash huge amounts of power once killed off by EGR

[NautiGirl]

Don't disagree at all, if I had a 250 it would have a PowerStroke. I guess I didn't do a good job of expressing my point, but it was that the 1/2 Ton diesel option was a waste and that one should move up to a 2/3 Ton truck if they were going to buy something w/o spark plugs.

[Tuscany]

Well, the original powerstroke was also a waste. Too heavy and no power. I'm guessing the automakers are tip toeing with the small diesel. Very uncertain.
What we see in the next 10 years may be totally different.

[NautiGirl]

Problem right now is Ford Made the 3.5 EcoBoost too good of an engine and they built the 3.0l diesel to not eat into its market share. The 3.5 Eco makes 375HP and 470ft/lb of torque. The 3.0 PowerStroke makes 250hp and 440 torques. Yes, the diesel gets a bit better MPG towing, but not by much. Makes the diesel a tough $9,500 upgrade.

I don't disagree smaller forced induction engines are the future, I just think right now for a 1/2 Ton truck gas forced induction makes a lot more sense than a small turbo diesel.

[Tuscany]

I agree with you as of today’s emission laws.
Current clean diesels are so clean, that it’s mind boggling. The future I believe. I’m not a tree hugger, but why pollute if we don’t have to? We already paid the SCR development price..

It’s going to depend, as always on who is writing the emissions laws. The current laws written by the Obama administration forced Diesel engine producers to get clean. Yeah, there were some major costs involved, and lots of breakdowns, but we are very close to a completely reliable and clean emissions engine.

Anyone here remember the 70’s? Maybe in L.A. or New York City? Yeah, you don’t want to go back to that..

[Driller]

Here's a real low blow teaser BB.
If you are going to play with HP, do yourself a huge service. Save the change and buy a diesel next go. Any of them. Cummins, Duramaxipad or Power Stroke. For you, crew cab for the Fam. Lots of them out there now, and with your connections......

My last Super Duty dynoed 1186 lbs of torque on a KEM 345 delete tuner and exhaust. Cost about $2,500. EGR gone. An instant 300 hp, couple that with 24 MPG highway. Towing was a joke. I never ran the quarter with it, but identical set ups ran in the high 11's/low 12's with 3:73s. . Seriously plug and play..
Gasoline can not support real power upgrades unless you rebuild everything, and even then, it won't come close to stock diesel numbers. Even if you can make a few lbs of gasoline torque, it will be at an RPM level that you never use.

I made the mistake of going back to gas on this GMC. I got caught up on 1,500 under invoice and a huge rebate. Towing is a joke in the other direction. I'm going back to diesel..

A man after my own heart. I'm a huge fan of diesels, any diesel. I've owned 4 cyl, and 6 cyl. My next one will be one of the big boys. Everyone I've owned pulls like a train. I have about 80k on my Cayenne now and it is still running like the day I got it. Gets 30 mpg running 80 mph.

[cmattj]

Yes the small diesels are coming.

The trucks and cars see them now. Fuel mileage average is combined across the mfg to comply with mpg requirements. Yep thats why hybrid electric cars move the average so auto makers build them and add them to their stats with combined models offered.

But the one advantage is it’s the 3/4 tons and 1tons that have the capacity and drivetrain technology to endure high torq. Sure you can have the power to take off from a stop in a 1/2 ton with a small differential pulling 8000 lbs ,but it’s the whole package from brakes, tires and that rear differential that make the difference we take for granted.

A few short years ago corvette Z06 403hp only came with a manual transmission. Now we see 750hp corvettes with 8 speeds automatics and paddle shift.

Engine tech seems to be always ahead of the rest of the drivetrain. Boats too!

I love the Dirty Max ( thanks BB) and have had many over the years as they do it all . But unhook your trailers and boats and you’ll wish you had a 1/2 ton for the other 98% we use our vehicles. ( Are 10 ply tires at 80 psi really a wonderful ride???)

Small diesels are coming for this reason. Ok coffe time